Obama infanticide craziness Part 2
And now...my lengthy response:
Ok, so first thing is first. My brother-in-law may never tell me what I can't talk about. My country is in this war, and my country has freedom of speech. I can talk about whatever I choose. I would not, however, presume to understand what it feels like to be a soldier over there and originally, neither did Dann. He simply stated his belief that we shouldn't be there for 100 years, and I agree. I do not believe that withdrawing troops is "quiting" or "losing" because there is no winning or losing in this case. We went in (supposedly) to help the people of Iraq take back their government and country. I believe that America has trained the Iraqi army to police themselves and that they have the surplus in revenue to carry on themselves. We aren't their keepers; they should learn to govern themselves. A small military presence there for the future (such as the one we still have in Vietnam) would be a good idea, but the rest of the troops should come home.
Next on the agenda: "So which is the greater evil... a baby born ALIVE, being abandoned IN A HOSPITAL and left to die while he is able to be saved, or me having chicken soup for dinner?"
I believe this is a simultaneous dig at Obama's decision that McCain is toting, about how he "voted in favor of late-term abortions" and Dann's veganism. Let' tackle Obama first.
Barack Obama voted against a new state bill to restrict late-term partial birth abortions, and this is why:
"On an issue like partial birth abortion, I strongly believe that the state can properly restrict late-term abortions. I have said so repeatedly. All I've said is we should have a provision to protect the health of the mother, and many of the bills that came before me didn't have that. Part of the reason they didn't have it was purposeful, because those who are opposed to abortion have a moral calling to try to oppose what they think is immoral. Oftentimes what they were trying to do was to polarize the debate and make it more difficult for people, so that they could try to bring an end to abortions overall.
As president, my goal is to bring people together, to listen to them, and I don't think there's any Republican out there who I've worked with who would say that I don't listen to them, I don't respect their ideas, I don't understand their perspective. And my goal is to get us out of this polarizing debate where we're always trying to score cheap political points and actually get things done." http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Barack_Obama_Abortion.htm
He even answered this in the debate; how there was already state laws against late term abortions, but made allowances only in case of the health of the mother. The new bill cut that out, so he voted against it. Even the medical board of this particular state said the bill was not a good idea.
Now, as for the veganism. When a chicken is made into soup, it is already born. It is alive, out in the world and fully capable of feeling pain. A fetus, by lawful definition, is none of these things. That is why Dann doesn't eat chicken soup, but can be pro-choice. What sort of boggles me is that a person who believes that life starts at conception CAN eat animals; which is definitely murder. Don't get me wrong, I am no vegetarian and can't see myself ever being one; but I am also not telling everyone to respect life, then eating it.
I am extremely tired of Pro-life advocates calling Pro-choice "pro-abortion" or "pro-infanticide." That is like calling Pro-life "Pro-unwanted forced pregnancy" or "Pro-die in child birth." Pro-choice is the OPTION of having an abortion, not a requirement! Pro-life is about protecting what they deem to be a child. I don't even like the term Pro-life, as it assumes that Pro-choice doesn't agree with life and that is ridiculous. Pro-choice provides just that...a choice. Pro-life states that you must have a child, no choice or input from the mother and that is unacceptable. I also do not see how a Pro-life advocate can call an abortion murder, but not believe a mother should then be charged for having an illegal one, should Rowe be overturned. If it is murder, wouldn't that make the mother a killer? "Of course not," Sarah Palin said to Katie Couric. This is hypocritical, and really weakens the defense that abortion is murder.
As for the God issue. I think that Dann does use it as a fall back position, as religion in general is something he wholeheartedly disagrees with. However, I believe that Jen does the same thing in reverse. Not everything boils down to religion. Jen has her beliefs, and if God is the reason she has them, then that is her perogative. If Dann disagrees, that is fine too; his reasons just aren't based on a lack of belief, but on his own definition of a moral code.
For the record, I think that Barack Obama is the best thing to happen to this country in a long, sad time. He is smart, eloquent, empathetic and understanding. His charisma helps him to convey his ideas in a way that everyone can understand; he doesn't talk down to anyone.
Also for the record, I did not dislike John McCain the first time he ran. I thought he was a more moderate republican who I just disagreed with on policies. My view on him has changed dramatically in the passed few months. I had serious doubts when he chose Sarah Palin. Her "cuteness" to win votes puts women in politics back 30 years. She has no idea what she is talking about, but likes to scream whatever it is loudly. She is ignorant, for lack of a better word and when I refer to her I will get childish and call her names, because I hate her.
I might have been semi-ok with McCain, but absolutely not with this woman. McCain's recent inflammation of peoples' fear for Obama has made me completely dislike him now. Granted, Lil-Miss-Tool started it with her "terrorism" nonsense, but he could have diffused it. When people at his rally were shouting "Terrorist!" "Karl Marx!" and shockingly "Hang Him!" McCain should have stopped it. Simply stated "We are not saying he himself is a terrorist, we question his choices. He is not Karl Marx, and whomever said 'hang him' should leave immediately." THAT would have impressed me. Instead, his campaign created this monster that they can no longer control, and that is legally RECKLESS ENDANGERMENT. If anyone else had done this publicly, they would have been charged and sued. Obama's life is in danger because of this, and there is no excuse for that.
I really do think that you all know what subjects are touchy for everyone, and it seems to me that they should just be avoided. No one is going to change any one's mind, so why start a fight? How about you both stop sending inflammatory things, and you just get along how you can, as brother and sister?
Love you all.
Ok, so first thing is first. My brother-in-law may never tell me what I can't talk about. My country is in this war, and my country has freedom of speech. I can talk about whatever I choose. I would not, however, presume to understand what it feels like to be a soldier over there and originally, neither did Dann. He simply stated his belief that we shouldn't be there for 100 years, and I agree. I do not believe that withdrawing troops is "quiting" or "losing" because there is no winning or losing in this case. We went in (supposedly) to help the people of Iraq take back their government and country. I believe that America has trained the Iraqi army to police themselves and that they have the surplus in revenue to carry on themselves. We aren't their keepers; they should learn to govern themselves. A small military presence there for the future (such as the one we still have in Vietnam) would be a good idea, but the rest of the troops should come home.
Next on the agenda: "So which is the greater evil... a baby born ALIVE, being abandoned IN A HOSPITAL and left to die while he is able to be saved, or me having chicken soup for dinner?"
I believe this is a simultaneous dig at Obama's decision that McCain is toting, about how he "voted in favor of late-term abortions" and Dann's veganism. Let' tackle Obama first.
Barack Obama voted against a new state bill to restrict late-term partial birth abortions, and this is why:
"On an issue like partial birth abortion, I strongly believe that the state can properly restrict late-term abortions. I have said so repeatedly. All I've said is we should have a provision to protect the health of the mother, and many of the bills that came before me didn't have that. Part of the reason they didn't have it was purposeful, because those who are opposed to abortion have a moral calling to try to oppose what they think is immoral. Oftentimes what they were trying to do was to polarize the debate and make it more difficult for people, so that they could try to bring an end to abortions overall.
As president, my goal is to bring people together, to listen to them, and I don't think there's any Republican out there who I've worked with who would say that I don't listen to them, I don't respect their ideas, I don't understand their perspective. And my goal is to get us out of this polarizing debate where we're always trying to score cheap political points and actually get things done." http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Barack_Obama_Abortion.htm
He even answered this in the debate; how there was already state laws against late term abortions, but made allowances only in case of the health of the mother. The new bill cut that out, so he voted against it. Even the medical board of this particular state said the bill was not a good idea.
Now, as for the veganism. When a chicken is made into soup, it is already born. It is alive, out in the world and fully capable of feeling pain. A fetus, by lawful definition, is none of these things. That is why Dann doesn't eat chicken soup, but can be pro-choice. What sort of boggles me is that a person who believes that life starts at conception CAN eat animals; which is definitely murder. Don't get me wrong, I am no vegetarian and can't see myself ever being one; but I am also not telling everyone to respect life, then eating it.
I am extremely tired of Pro-life advocates calling Pro-choice "pro-abortion" or "pro-infanticide." That is like calling Pro-life "Pro-unwanted forced pregnancy" or "Pro-die in child birth." Pro-choice is the OPTION of having an abortion, not a requirement! Pro-life is about protecting what they deem to be a child. I don't even like the term Pro-life, as it assumes that Pro-choice doesn't agree with life and that is ridiculous. Pro-choice provides just that...a choice. Pro-life states that you must have a child, no choice or input from the mother and that is unacceptable. I also do not see how a Pro-life advocate can call an abortion murder, but not believe a mother should then be charged for having an illegal one, should Rowe be overturned. If it is murder, wouldn't that make the mother a killer? "Of course not," Sarah Palin said to Katie Couric. This is hypocritical, and really weakens the defense that abortion is murder.
As for the God issue. I think that Dann does use it as a fall back position, as religion in general is something he wholeheartedly disagrees with. However, I believe that Jen does the same thing in reverse. Not everything boils down to religion. Jen has her beliefs, and if God is the reason she has them, then that is her perogative. If Dann disagrees, that is fine too; his reasons just aren't based on a lack of belief, but on his own definition of a moral code.
For the record, I think that Barack Obama is the best thing to happen to this country in a long, sad time. He is smart, eloquent, empathetic and understanding. His charisma helps him to convey his ideas in a way that everyone can understand; he doesn't talk down to anyone.
Also for the record, I did not dislike John McCain the first time he ran. I thought he was a more moderate republican who I just disagreed with on policies. My view on him has changed dramatically in the passed few months. I had serious doubts when he chose Sarah Palin. Her "cuteness" to win votes puts women in politics back 30 years. She has no idea what she is talking about, but likes to scream whatever it is loudly. She is ignorant, for lack of a better word and when I refer to her I will get childish and call her names, because I hate her.
I might have been semi-ok with McCain, but absolutely not with this woman. McCain's recent inflammation of peoples' fear for Obama has made me completely dislike him now. Granted, Lil-Miss-Tool started it with her "terrorism" nonsense, but he could have diffused it. When people at his rally were shouting "Terrorist!" "Karl Marx!" and shockingly "Hang Him!" McCain should have stopped it. Simply stated "We are not saying he himself is a terrorist, we question his choices. He is not Karl Marx, and whomever said 'hang him' should leave immediately." THAT would have impressed me. Instead, his campaign created this monster that they can no longer control, and that is legally RECKLESS ENDANGERMENT. If anyone else had done this publicly, they would have been charged and sued. Obama's life is in danger because of this, and there is no excuse for that.
I really do think that you all know what subjects are touchy for everyone, and it seems to me that they should just be avoided. No one is going to change any one's mind, so why start a fight? How about you both stop sending inflammatory things, and you just get along how you can, as brother and sister?
Love you all.
posted by Gibulet @ 9:59 AM
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